Investigating Woo: Spring Forest Qigong “research”

Written by in Review, Science at October 29, 2011

This is a follow-up to my previous post investigating a study from the Mayo Clinic in collaboration with the University of Minnesota claiming that external qigong, a form of ancient Chinese medicine, is an effective treatment for chronic pain. My critique apparently got on the nerves of at least one person, Drew Hempel, qigong enthusiast and woo extraordinaire, who offered his assurance regarding the validity of the study and its methodology. Sadly, it’s not assurance that I am after—it’s evidence. However, maybe I was wrong; maybe the study was academically rigorous and its conclusions actually sound. After all, I am only an undergraduate (despite the fact that, in a recent blog post, Hempel incorrectly described me as a “university senior biologist”), and I admittedly only read the abstract.

Mr. Hempel has posted on internet blogs and forums statements such as the following:

Last fall there was a new study done by doctors from one of the top rated hospitals in the world — the Mayo Clinic in Minnesota. The study proved the existence and the efficacy of external qi (paranormal energy) healing transmission. . . O.K. I want to emphasize the implications of this study. This is ground-breaking official proof of something that undermines the very foundation of science.

Such extraordinary claims require even more extraordinary evidence, and Hempel believes, along with many, many others, that this evidence exists in a study performed at the Spring Forest Qigong center in Minnesota, published in The American Journal of Chinese Medicine.

After Hempel’s criticisms of my post and his request that I not “give up so easily” in my search for truth (I suggest Hempel do the same), I decided to check whether or not my university subscribed to the specific journal in order to obtain the full text of External Qigong for Chronic Pain (2010), the study that had supposedly demonstrated the efficacy of qigong. Much to my surprise, they do, and I found it. While reading the study, my initial criticisms based on the abstract alone became more and more cemented. I am now-more than ever-convinced that the study is absolutely bunk from the top down. The flaws are numerous, and I have included them below in point form, followed by a more in-depth criticism regarding the methodology behind each.

1. Flawed sampling method.

2. Lack of adequate controls.

3. Subjectivity in data collection.

4. Reliance on anecdotal evidence.


Flawed sampling method

Generally, when attempting to draw statistics from a given population, a method is used to ensure that those individuals (the units) chosen for the study are representative of the population as a whole and do not reflect some sort of uneven sampling which could skew results. For example, if one were to try to acquire statistics estimating the percentage of Americans who are bedridden by sitting in a park, tallying people as they walk past, the estimate would be radically off kilter due to the fact that bedridden people, because they are bedridden, are not going to be in the park, and thus will be excluded from the study. This is known as a sampling bias, and the Spring Forest Qigong (SFQ) experiment represents a textbook case. Here is how subjects were chosen to participate in the SFQ study (emphasis mine):

All 50 participants were recruited from those who called the Spring Forest Qigong (SFQ) Center, in Minneapolis, Minnesota, to make an initial appointment for external qigong. The SFQ receptionist asked callers if they suffered from chronic pain. Those who responded positively to the question were offered the opportunity to participate in the study . . .

It should be immediately clear to anyone that the above is extremely sloppy, biased methodology. The population (or the parameter of interest) is not defined. Presumably it is “all humans with chronic pain,” but this study fails to obtain that because they only chose subjects who called the clinic requesting qigong treatment. Every subject chosen to participate in the study was therefore already partial to the idea that qigong would be an effective treatment for their pain. The actual parameter they are testing is “humans with chronic pain who believe qigong works,” which creates extremely fertile ground for a placebo effect.

Furthermore, the fact that subjects were able to decide whether or not they would even participate in the study is problematic. This potentially creates what is known as a self-selection bias, which is a recognition of that fact that the choice to participate in a study may often be correlated with other factors about the person that could affect the results; in other words, it sometimes means the participants are not truly representative regarding the population of interest.

To further add to the list of biases evident throughout the study, I found a bit of information to be particularly interesting. I refer to the way in which subjects were compensated for their participation.

In compensation for their time, each participant received a 50% discount off the usual fee for EQT for each of their four qigong visits. This represented a discount of approximately $200 for each participant.

In case you missed it, I’ll spell it out for you. The subjects were paying money to have the treatment. It is obvious that someone who has invested $200 in a treatment that they already believe to be effective would be more likely to report that their condition has improved, perhaps fooling themselves, otherwise they have to admit that they’ve just been duped by con people. I am reminded of a family friend who cannot tell the difference between a plain glass earring and one made from authentic diamond, that is, until she is told which is which, whereby thereafter she insists she can, of course, now see the difference. Now it is obviously shinier! If she were told the glass was the diamond, I am sure she would have responded similarly. The bottom line is, if you’re investing serious cash for treatment, you’re likely, though unconsciously, preparing yourself for it to work. I don’t even know if this bias has a name, so I’ll coin a term and dub it the investment bias. Once again, the subjects are susceptible to the placebo effect.

Lastly, and this is a point I made in my first article, 74% of the participants were taking other forms of medication in concert with qigong. Even more worrying, 30% (15 people) reported increasing or decreasing their doses, beginning new prescriptive medications, or discontinuing a previous medication during the four-week trial period. This adds a lot of noise to the data, making it extremely difficult to draw conclusions ascertaining the cause of any positive results.

Lack of adequate control groups

This is perhaps the most revealing, and certainly the most crippling aspect of the SFQ study. One gets the impression that proponents of ancient Chinese wisdom, especially those purporting the validity of a force, or energy, called qi (also known as “chi”), desperately want to demonstrate its reality scientifically. They have science envy. Indeed, many believers of qi, and the use of qigong as a means to “regulate its flow” and achieve “dynamic mind-body integration,” whatever that means, claim that qigong is extremely effective in treating serious conditions and illnesses such as late-term cancer, multiple sclerosis, and Parkinson’s disease. So, one would think, scientifically demonstrating qigong’s efficacy with respect to the amelioration of acute, chronic pain should be a cake-walk. However, when actually given the chance to put up or shut up, most paranormal “researchers” fail to implement the most basic of techniques to ensure reliability of their results. This failure usually arises due to the lack of adequate controls set up to help rule out alternative hypotheses. The SFQ study is, sadly, no different.

The subjects were divided into two groups, one that received external qigong treatment (EQT), and one that received equal attention time (EAT). Right away a mental red-flag is raised; what on earth is equal attention time? The paper explains:

For the control [EAT] group, an investigator engaged each participant in conversation and provided full attention to the participant for 25 to 30 min.

This is their idea of a control, and it is seriously inexcusable methodology. This study is masquerading around as science, attempting to persuade people of the legitimacy of qigong, yet their actual intent—to deceive—is all too apparent due to the lack of adequate controls protecting against the placebo effect. Here is what they should have done, and its simplicity counters any excuse for its omission. There should have been three groups. One being the group receiving actual qigong treatment, another receiving a mock qigong treatment, where subjects think they are receiving proper qigong treatment but are not, and a final group that receives no treatment (a zero stimulus group). What this adds to the experiment is a way to tell whether or not external qigong treatment performs better than a similarly administered placebo (the mock or “sham” treatment). It also allows comparison of any of the stimulus groups to the zero stimulus group. Although no excuse would be adequate to resolve the issue of the missing control, they sure enough offered one, and it’s pretty ridiculous.

. . . in keeping with qigong philosophy and at the request of the qigong master, sham treatments were avoided and replaced with EAT and delayed treatments. Thus, deception was avoided and control subjects also had the opportunity to benefit from their experience. Our goal was to provide the actual qigong experience for the research subjects as much as possible without imposing Western biomedical concepts on the practice.

Tell me, what is the point? Why bother having any experiment at all in an attempt to convincingly demonstrate the validity of qigong to the greater scientific community if you’re going to side-step the whole process? Who is the target audience of this study? It’s certainly not people already into ancient Chinese medicine—they are already sold on the idea. And the target audience simply couldn’t be the scientific community, since they state in clear terms that qigong philosophy forbids “Western biomedical concepts,” such as including a controlled placebo group which is a sine qua non condition for these types of studies. I believe the intended crowd is the general, scientifically illiterate public. Most people won’t read the actual study, and simply trust the researchers at their word. Now, with a study to point to, qigong practitioners gain a wider public audience and the appearance of credibility.

The fact that no sham treatments were given is extremely concerning, and it indeed undermines the validity of the entire study. Additionally, subjects knew that they were participating in a study, which leaves the door wide open for an attention bias on top of the already prevalent placebo effect. The term attention bias refers to the fact that people who know they are participating in a study generally behave differently than they would if they were totally oblivious to the fact that data taken about them was going to be used in a study. Subjects should not have been informed that they were being studied.

Subjectivity in data collection

The method in which initial pain data was collected from test subjects was extremely subjective, and all subsequent pain data was subject to a recall bias. Participants’ pain was assessed using a visual analog scale (VAS), which is simply a 10-cm line with the left side representing “no pain” and the far right labeled “pain as bad as it could possibly be.” Here is how it looks:

Prior to testing, the test subjects were told to draw a line, from left to right, stopping at a point along the line that accurately represents their current level of pain. This is very subjective, since obviously they are experiencing some pain, yet probably have no real way to conceptualize the worst pain possible. The scale simply isn’t in the realm of common experience. Furthermore, before each of the four weekly treatments, subjects retook a VAS pain test, and all of the VAS pain data was later compared at the end of the study. The problem with this method of assessing pain is that each participant is relying on memory alone when reporting updated pain data, and memory isn’t very reliable. This is known as a recall bias. In the study, each person knows how long of a line they drew the previous week, and must rely solely on memory of that week-old state in order to decide how much their pain is receding away from the worst, most excruciating pain imaginable. I don’t think I could do that. Poor recollection of the past, coupled with all the biases elucidated above and the fact that people who know they are being studied act differently, paves the way for substantial conscious or unconscious distortion of data.

Reliance on anecdotal evidence

The textbook Statistics for the Life Sciences states the following:

The accumulation of anecdotes often leads to conjecture and to scientific investigation, but it is predictable pattern, not anecdote, that establishes a scientific theory.

I couldn’t have said it better myself. It really gets to the heart of what science is all about: making predictions. The website for Spring Forest Qigong boasts about its page full of personal testimonies of those supposedly healed of major ailments. But, as indicated above, these testimonies should only be used as justification for further inquiry. Taken alone, these testimonies do not amount to evidence for the efficacy of qigong. Michael Shermer, founder of The Skeptics Society, wrote an article for Scientific American discussing the reason people erroneously find anecdotal evidence so convincing.

. . . [T]hinking anecdotally comes naturally, whereas thinking scientifically does not. . . The reason for this cognitive disconnect is that we have evolved brains that pay attention to anecdotes because false positives (believing there is a connection between A and B when there is not) are usually harmless, whereas false negatives (believing there is no connection between A and B when there is) may take you out of the gene pool. Our brains are belief engines that employ association learning to seek and find patterns. Superstition and belief in magic are millions of years old, whereas science, with its methods of controlling for intervening variables to circumvent false positives, is only a few hundred years old. So it is that any medical huckster promising that A will cure B has only to advertise a handful of successful anecdotes in the form of testimonials.

And anecdotal testimonies are literally all that Spring Forest Qigong has; no wonder they’re so obsessed with them. However, they’re completely lacking where it actually counts—hard data derived from properly controlled experiments.

Conclusion

I have demonstrated that the Spring Forest Qigong study does not meet even the lowest bar of relevant experimental standards to support their conclusion that external qigong treatment is effective at ameliorating chronic pain. In fact, I hesitate to even call it a study, since those performing it inexcusably left out many essential procedural necessities, the most obvious being a proper placebo control group. Ignorance of this methodology is no excuse, as this is considered the “Gold Standard” in experimental procedure, and is perhaps one of the first research tools taught in science and statistics classrooms worldwide.

In order to preemptively counter some criticisms, I feel that I must emphasize that I do not believe a study must be flawless in order to be worthy of publication. It is impossible to perform a perfect experiment, controlling for every conceivable source of bias and error. However, what is expected of an experiment is that it be performed using the best possible methods under reasonable conditions. It seems quite obvious that those performing the study in question showed little to no effort or concern with carrying out properly controlled experimental procedure that would have, in no small way, safeguarded their study against such novice error.

I find it difficult not to question the sincerity of those involved in the study, namely Ann Vincent, Jamia Hill, Kelly M. Kruk, Stephen S. Cha, and Brent A. Bauer. I do not believe they approached this study in an attempt to honestly demonstrate the validity of qigong, but instead purposefully cut experimental corners in order to lend credence to their own paranormal leanings. The Mayo Clinic and the University of Minnesota should be ashamed and embarrassed to have their name associated with a study demonstrating such a poor grasp of experimental methodology, scientific rigor, and intellectual honesty.

Lastly, I call into question the peer review process (or perhaps lack thereof) within The American Journal of Chinese Medicine. What does it say about the academic standards of such a journal when a biology undergraduate is able to render a paper completely and utterly invalid?

It cannot be repeated enough, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Has the Mayo Clinic and University of Minnesota supported their extraordinary claim with equally compelling evidence? The answer is a resounding “No,” they have not.

NOTE: Replication of copyrighted materials above is in compliance with the Fair Use Doctrine.

Discussion

Colin: I applaud your effort in debunking qigong healing but as the researcher of the Mayo Clinic study states — the external energy treatment was extraordinary considering the subjects had long term chronic pain not treatable by western science.

Your focus has been on the lack of a placebo control instead of a “zero” control that was used in the study but as Isabelle Stenger points out, if the placebo works then it’s not really a control anyway. There’s nothing inherently wrong with a placebo, especially if it is still effective eight weeks after the treatment.

Now if you can point out any previous placebo that would be effective eight weeks after of the treatment for chronic pain not treatable by Western medicine then you might have evidence which would challenge the credibility of the qigong study results. haha.

On the other hand Colin you do mention that the numerous testimonies of people healed of serious conditions merits further investigation of the validity of qigong. My question is why you have not taken the step for these further investigations. The testimonies were also presented on the local news station and the testimonies are corroborated by the Western doctors who have overseen the healings. The qigong masters have also taught the Mayo Clinic doctors and there are doctors recommending the qigong practice as well.

Chunyi Lin has even shown the x-rays from the doctors of before and after treatments for conditions that are not subject to placebo effects — conditions that require physical transformations of the body in a dramatic manner.

So the evidence is indeed extraordinary but as usual the skeptics refuse to investigate further, instead choosing to keep their heads in the sand. Why doesn’t PZ Myers go meet Chunyi Lin to see if he can test the energy transmissions? Colin why don’t you just call the healing center to get a phone healing and then honestly report what you experience? Surely you as a skeptic would not be amenable to the placebo effect, no matter how powerful it might be. haha. Just be honest about what you experience.

Meanwhile Chunyi Lin and similar qigong masters like Effie P. Chow, continue their successful healing practices where they can focus their energy on healing people, using love energy. This is why the placebo control is not used because the qigong master can feel the pain of the person they are with so it is not fair to do a pretend healing for another person.

On the other hand if the healing does work but it is considered to be just a placebo then that it just a term for something that is undefinable by Western science. This is also why a “double blind” study can not be done because the definition of qi is more of an open flowing process — similar to the time-frequency uncertainty principle in quantum physics.

Again Colin I appreciate you expressing your frustrations with the methodology of this randomized, controlled “gold standard” study. If you continue to be curious about why these doctors are amazed that qigong works to heal chronic pain then you may just find out what it is like to experience a qigong energy transmission yourself! China and India had civilization twice as long as the West and the qigong practice can even be traced back the Bushmen culture, the original humans of Africa. I realize you consider antiquity to not be an excuse for legitimacy but I mention this to point out there are very strong cross cultural examples based on the same principle of qigong. If qigong works, and it does, then as an objective truth it should also be found in other cultures. You can find similar qigong results in the contemplative monastic tradition in the West, not as common, since they lack the yogic body training, but nevertheless still evident.

It’s a big world out there Colin. Have fun doing more investigations because as Socrates stated, the more you know, the more you know that you don’t know. So you can trust that you’ll always enjoy deeper levels of mystery as long as you keep your heart open to really pursuing the truth.

Spring Forest Qigong “study” debunked « Warm Little Pond

[...] Originally posted on An American Atheist. [...]

Colin this is the relevant evidence you should address:

Conclusions:

“Subjects with chronic pain who received external qigong experienced reduction in pain intensity following each qigong treatment. This is especially impressive given the long duration of pain (>5 years) in the most of the participants,” writes lead author Ann Vincent, MD, MBBS, Mayo Clinic, Rochester, Minnesota.

Christine Rice

Drew Hempel,

You can make all the excuses you want for why qigong healing can’t follow the standard scientific method because of the “open flowing process”, but if it doesn’t follow the scientific method don’t try to pass it off as science. It is insulting to the scientific community to see woo, and yes this is woo, passed off as science. I don’t even care if it’s as real as can be and if I tried it I would feel something. Go ahead and tell people they have to try it for themselves, that is fine, but do not say there is scientific evidence when there clearly is not.

Yes excuses or placebos — are just labels. Some prefer the “X factor.” What the scientific method is obviously is open to debate — whether it’s Karl Polyani or Karl Popper or Paul Feyerbend, etc. But the Mayo Clinic is a top research hospital and their results are not woo woo — in fact quite the contrary: Bold and dramatic concrete results.

So the woo woo masters (i.e. the skeptics) can ignore the dramatic personal testimonies of other Mayo Clinic patients healed of hard to treat conditions like breast cancer and the rare lung disease — requiring a lung transplant! These are personal testimonies corroborated by doctors from the Mayo Clinic with x-rays. haha. If the woo woo masters want to live in a bubble of willful ignorance that’s awesome! That means more and more people can actually practice spring forest qigong and be healed!

I, as a truly courageous researcher, decided to conduct the experiments myself — again on the terms and definitions of the qigong tradition which comes from Daoyin or Taoist Yoga. If you skeptics really want the technical details of how to do the experiments then study the book: “Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality” translated by Charles Luk. I followed that book in great detail while I took the qigong classes, receiving the energy transmissions from the qigong master. I got to chapters 9 to 11 in the book “Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality” — the electromagnetic fields I produced were so powerful that people were freaking out around me. I did some excellent healing but it is dangerous unless the energy can be controlled as well.

Thanks for your interest Christine Rice and I wish you further happy enquires into this amazing mystery called qigong — or should I say Miss-Story. haha. Let’s not be afraid of the history of China, India or Africa — we have much to learn but investigating the realms of the unknown.

You can just look up the youtube videos of Effie P. Chow doing qigong healing. Or you can pretend she has not been a successful qigong healer for many years. I first experienced her amazing energy in 1995 when she did a qi-transmission talk at a local University in MInneapolis. Effie P. Chow blew the fuse out in the room behind us, as was reported by the security guard wondering what was going on in our little session, at that time almost shut down for the night.

So there’s many amazing “testimonies” of people who have the courage to actually investigate qigong first-hand instead of being couch-critics as it were. That’s right — make a phone call to get a healing! Be a skeptic, free of the placebo effect but honestly report what you experience! Meanwhile the Mayo Clinic doctors can stand by their randomized controlled study with the practical results of people with long term chronic pain now relieved, despite the futile efforts of Western medicine.

Honestly does Colin really think that people with long term chronic pain would have some sort of psychological blockage that needed a qigong placebo treatment to unblock? If this is true — so be it! haha. Qigong is based on the excuse or x-factor that all of reality is interwoven and the energy can be transformed. There are some parallels in Western medicine — for example in acupuncture there’s new research on biophoton channels. Qigong is considered a needless acupuncture but it is much more powerful.

Basically there’s three types of energy used in qigong — the electrochemical or emotional energy and then the electromagnetic energy and then laser energy. I have given more details in my book on the transformation or transduction process for this energy training. But the closest process in Western science is the “Time-Frequency Uncertainty Principle” in quantum physics.

Yes the “Time-Frequency Uncertainty Principle” is very real and has similar results as an “excuse” or mysterious x-factor for energy transformation.

http://www.box.net/shared/go46254prfd1naqrk2tx

Here’s Cambridge University anthropologist Dr. Lee Wilson’s newly published testimony of his experience of qigong energy. This is a truly skeptical report of the foibles and the excuses and the amazing miracles.

I’ve since corresponded with Dr. Lee Wilson who is doing research in Indonesia and he has expressed interest in further investigating spring forest qigong as well.

And I quote Dr. Lee Wilson of Cambridge University:

“From my experiences with the man, as far as I have been able to ascertain he is able to generate a force from his body, which he describes as Qi, which seems to me to have electrical like properties. That he can do so is in contradistinction to conceptions of the body that hold sway in western medicinal theory and, as far as I’m aware, the laws of physics that currently prevail. Therefore, from the perspective of a sceptical enquirer I am willing to acknowledge the possibility of this man’s abilities being exceptional.”

from Dr. Lee Wilson’s article “The Anthropology of the Possible: The Ethnographer as a Sceptical Enquirer” October 2011.

1. You do not seem to understand what placebo means and how it relates to a scientific study. For some reason you hold onto the idea that if there is a measurable placebo effect in a study that it means the given activity could work. It simply means that the activity, in this case Qi usage, is identical to doing nothing other than convincing the participant that it works. Placebo does not represent this unknown mystery that science has yet to figure out — you don’t understand this whatsoever.

2. This article you listed does nothing but talk about personal experience and a video that the person watched. The person even talks about how easy it would be to fake or alter the video and there are many magicians who can do similar things. Personal experience is also amongst the worst kinds of evidence one could ever provide for finding out if a claim is true or not. If you gave someone a sugar pill, they would tell you that from their personal experience the pill helped them with a headache. I could go on at length about the flaws of using personal experience to make truth claims. The person then seems to express extreme displeasure over the fact that fellow academics don’t accept claims without evidence or proper research and that everyone scoffed at the film. This in no way establishes any of the claims about Qi.

3. Yes, indeed, not believing that something will work and then trying it would probably prevent a placebo effect from working. However, I highly doubt that one person’s personal experience about it not working would convince you, since you would compare it to the massive amounts of personal testimony you have seen and read — and I again reiterate, personal experience is perhaps the worst method of testing whether or not something is true that you could conceivably use.

4. Maybe you should do some research, as you claim to always be doing, into acupuncture, which is another nonsense field of medicine with no effects other than placebo (and in some recorded instruments brings about detrimental effects).

If a qigong master “convinces” someone they are doing a healing when in fact (according to sceptics this healing is impossible) and then the healing in fact does work — ergo it is a placebo by the definition of the sceptics.

Thanks for reiterating the basic definition of a placebo so I could clarify my point as the logic might be too subtle for the average reader.

The video you are referring to is the demonstration and testing of qigong master John Chang in Indonesia. The video shows three Western trained scientists who test John Chang — these scientists give their names and their backgrounds and training are easily corroborated. Clearly the production of the video is not some highly staged fakery using cgi or some such. haha.

Again you state personal experience is not a means for testing science but this is not necessarily true. Medicine has clinical research which relies on case reports of people treated in hospitals and these case reports are the personal testimonies of the doctors. So are the doctors of the Mayo Clinic and the University of Minnesota actually being duped? Are their personal experiences just an extension of the placebo effect? haha. The methodology of science varies based on the discipline being practiced — an excellent researcher in this subject is Professor Harry M. Collins and especially his book Changing Order which investigates paranormal science methodology.

The essential issue is that there are parameters set in science as objective measurments but these parameters are based on a negative upper limit, using proof by contradiction. The original example of this is the square root of two proof by contradiction also called the power set axiom. As logician professors Philip Hugly and Charles Sayward prove in their 1999 essay, “Did the Greeks Discover the Irrationals?” the negative upper limit parameter is an error of logical type. http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=71219 There is a logical error between the geometric continuum as length and number as distance. Just because number as distance is infinite this doesn’t mean that the geometric continuum as length is infinite.

Philosophy

Philosophy (1999), 74 : pp 169-176
The Royal Institute of Philosophy 1999

Did the Greeks Discover the Irrationals?
Philip Hugly and Charles Sayward

Abstract

A popular view is that the great discovery of Pythagoras was that there are irrational numbers, e.g., the positive square root of two. Against this it is argued that mathematics and geometry, together with their applications, do not show that there are irrational numbers or compel assent to that proposition.

So going back to Professor Harry M. Collins expose on scientific methodology see Collins, H. M., (2003) `Lead Into Gold: The Science of Finding Nothing’, Studies in History and Philosophy of Science, 34, 4, 661-691

Abstract

The logic and sociology of upper limits and the logic and sociology of positive results are different. I explore the difference through a case study in the physical sciences. In the conclusion I ask why social sciences only rarely translate their negative findings into successes.

So qigong should be seen more as a social science than a hard science relying on geometric based technology to determine the basis for logical objectivity. Qigong, instead, relies on logical inference which is not a closed set. Medicine can be considered a combination of social and natural science since medicine relies on epidemological studies and also clinical research.

In regards to acupuncture you’re assuming I have not done any research but you don’t show any evidence that this is the case. haha. That’s an unfortunate mistake on your part because you shouldn’t make simple assumptions.

http://www.military.com/news/article/air-force-news/acupuncture-offers-alternative-relief.html

August 26, 2011
Air Force News|by Airman 1st Class Bahja J Jones

JOINT BASE ANDREWS, Md. — …

Master Sgt. Michelle Tancrede, the 779th Aerospace Medical Squadron mission operations NCO in charge, visited the clinic with back pain. After two hours of training, the group was able to alleviate some of the pain she experienced.

“I definitely felt a difference,” Tancrede said.

It has been reported that battlefield acupuncture is being implemented daily in Afghanistan and Iraq, Niemtzow said.

Army Maj. Charles Benner, a 29th Combat Aeromedical Physician Aviation Brigade assistant, attended the class only a few weeks before his deployment.

“I’m going to try it,” Benner said. “I’ve seen it done in the past, and it worked.”

“It is not better than western medicine, but it is a technique to relieve pain without any side effects that allows you to return back to duty much more rapidly than using medication,” Niemtzow said.

You again cite personal testimonies that “it works,” you are even doing this for acupuncture. The problem with this is that there are potentially infinite scenarios that you could convince someone that something works. I could convince some people that a magic rock I pick up from my backyard heals people. This would mean, according to you, that the rock IS actually working because it is healing people. This does not mean that the rock actually had any special properties. The ability of the mind to deceive us, which produces measurable effects, is what causes this and not the rock. If the use of Qi is a placebo, it means that is the same as a rock. And yes, different placebos function more or less than others. A sugar pill produces an effect, a smaller pill with a label to mirror prescription drugs produces more of an effect, and a syringe produces the largest effect — in none of these cases does the sugar or non-acting drug actually do anything itself. It’s very important if tests return the result that Qi results in only a placebo effect because it would be evidence against the existence of Qi. You don’t seem to understand that if a study shows no measurable difference between Qi use and people thinking they are being treated for pain, that while the Qi actually “healed” some people, it does not establish that Qi is a real thing.

I appreciate my comment reappearing on American Atheist! haha. Yes I understand your profound logic regarding placebos. If qigong works as a placebo then any other thing in the universe can work as a placebo. Yes, according to qigong, this is potentially true. For example the most famous qigong master in China, Dr. Yan Xin, once healed a person of severe diabetes by telling the person to drink lots of sugary fluids, despite this being the worst thing for the person’s diet. As Dr. Yan Xin states, the “yi” or intention of the chi is “bidirectional” so that energy blockages can be reversed if any damage is done by the healing energy. So another time Dr. Yan Xin was in a car that had the motor die and then Dr. Yan Xin directed energy from the power transmission line overhead — he directed it from the overhead line back down into the car. The car started smoking from too much energy and almost was fried so then Dr. Yan Xin then just reversed the direction of the energy. Then the car was healed and started.

So as I stated before there’s three types of energy in qigong — the electrochemical or emotional energy called jing and then the electromagnetic or mind energy called chi and then the spirit energy which is laser holographic. The holographic energy enables transmutation of matter into any other form but it derives its energy from the other two forms of energy. The “yi” or intention is the will power to the energy and is derived from the jing energy in the kidneys — these are called the internal reproductive organs in traditional Chinese medicine.

Beyond the energy is something not found in the West unless you consider some forms of quantum physics, like Bernard E’spagnat. This fourth aspect of qigong beyong the jing, chi and shen, is called the Emptiness or the Universe or Consciousness — it is formless but is also the potential energy and is constantly transforming. The consciousness is the impersonal process of energy transformation so it’s not the energy itself but it creates the light laser energy through harmonization.

So there must be a strict training of harmonization of the body and mind in order to create this laser or biophoton energy. The harmonization works through complementary opposites which are not recognized in Western science because they are an open system and also non-commutative. Again the closest example is the time-frequency uncertainty principle in quantum physics as the process of consciousness that creates energy.

You can tell if someone is a qigong master but how long they can comfortable sit in full lotus — this is a very easy test since no one can fake the full lotus yoga posture aka padmasana. So Chunyi Lin did his full lotus posture meditation in a cave — nonstop — for several weeks. In other words Chunyi Lin sat with his feet up on his thighs, with his legs crossed, in full lotus, without taking any food, water or sleep, for several weeks, non-stop. This is the cave meditation in the qigong training but it’s also found in the yoga tradition in India, Tibet, etc. — around the Himalayas.

As I stated previously the qigong training is equivalent to the Bushmen Khoisan shamanic trance dance training whereby N/om is the jing energy and the !Xia trance state is the samadhi of yoga training. Of course there’s further specific parallels but you get the idea.

Nevertheless a qigong master can do amazing transformations so that anything can be turned into a placebo — i.e. can have energy transforming effects. This is because according to the philosophy of qigong everything is energy and energy is always being transformed.

As I mentioned one of the personal testimonies is a person who was a Mayo Clinic patient with a rare lung disease that required a lung transplant. After eight weeks of her qigong training with Chunyi Lin she no longer needed her 24 hour oxygen machine and then the doctors tested her proving that she no longer had any lung scar tissue. This healing testimony was covered by the local news in Minnesota and the doctor corroborates the healing.

If you want to call this a placebo — by all means do so! haha.

My Spring Forest Qigong Healing Story — Skyler Krull — Epileptic Seizures.m4v

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=MerE0BXoq5E

In 1997, when Skyler Krull was seven years old, he began having seizures. When a MRI and EEG were unable to point to a cause, Skyler’s neurologist recommended anti-seizure medication. But after trying several medications, still the seizures continued.
Just after starting seventh grade, as he was about to turn 13, Skyler’s seizures became extremely severe. Subsequent hospitalization and testing revealed a brain tumor. Skyler’s doctors felt confident that once the tumor was removed the seizures should stop. However, after a high-risk yet successful surgery at the Mayo Clinic, Skyler’s seizures actually increased to nearly continuous episodes 18 or more hours a day. Skyler was unable to attend school for two years and required around-the-clock care.
His parents continued to seek answers and took him to the best neurologists they could find who continued to recommend trials of various anti-seizure medications. This led to Skyler at one point taking more than 30 pharmaceuticals each and every day and even more in the form of rescue or emergency meds. His doctors considered Skyler’s case the most serious of all the cases at their clinic. Since both surgery and medication were ineffective, they didn’t know what to do next.
It was at that point, in 2004 that Skyler’s mother, Lisa Proctor, learned of a Spring Forest Qigong practitioner named Lesley Vincent.* From that very first meeting with Lesley, Skyler started to improve. Using the SFQ techniques she had learned from Master Chunyi Lin Lesley helped Skyler realize that he was born with the ability to help heal himself. As Skyler explains it, “Lesley gave me my power back. Until then I was powerless and I had no life.”
It took a year to safely wean Skyler off of the more than 30 drugs he had been taking. Skyler kept improving, kept following Lesley’s guidance and as he puts it, “Lesley taught me to transform my epilepsy with love.” At Lesley’s recommendation both Skyler and Lisa studied SFQ Levels 1&2 with Master Chunyi Lin.
It took time but with Lesley’s help and guidance Skyler has grown into a happy and healthy young man who is in college studying eastern healing modalities. His goal is to help others to heal themselves as Lesley helped him.
*In 2010, Lesley Vincent became only the second person Master Lin has ever certified as a Spring Forest Qigong Master.

“Your focus has been on the lack of a placebo control instead of a “zero” control that was used in the study but as Isabelle Stenger points out, if the placebo works then it’s not really a control anyway.”

In every scientific paper I have ever read where experimental procedure involves manipulating test subjects in any way, sham control groups are always used. It is simply inexcusable to not include one. This would show whether or not qigong actually has an effect relative to a similarly administered placebo. This is boiler plate, introductory methodology. I cannot fathom why you are trying to defend the study’s sloppy methods. And if the placebo works, IT’S STILL A CONTROL, since it lacks an active ingredient.

“My question is why you have not taken the step for these further investigations.”

Because there doesn’t seem to be any reason to. There have been no properly controlled experiments lending credence to the idea that qi is a real force in nature. Given that this is an ancient Chinese practice, there is no excuse. It only means that there has been ample time for qi to be put to rigorous clinical trials. Believe me, there is not a scientist in the world who wouldn’t jump at the opportunity to demonstrate the existence of a force previously unknown to science. This is the kind of things Nobel prized are awarded for. Why doesn’t any qi practitioner just perform some actual clinical trials to demonstrate that qi is real ad claim a Nobel prize? Also, why doesn’t any qi practitioner take the James Randi Paranormal Challenge and claim the $1,000,000 prize? It should be a cake walk to demonstrate if qi is as real as you claim it is.

“Chunyi Lin has even shown the x-rays from the doctors of before and after treatments for conditions that are not subject to placebo effects — conditions that require physical transformations of the body in a dramatic manner.”

Again, anecdotes. Where is the actual study showing the statistical significance of these claims?

“Colin why don’t you just call the healing center to get a phone healing and then honestly report what you experience?”

I would be happy to call in. But the phone healings cost $90.00. Also, the idea that qi can be directed to any one of 7 billion people on earth over the phone is absolutely ridiculous. Please, enlighten me to the mechanism by which qi energy locates any individual on earth, adding energy to their glass of water, and how this energy acts on the body. I find it hard to believe that this elusive energy can be transmitted from the fingertips of a qigong master to a patient, and find it infinitely more peposterous that this qi has some sort of mind where it can be transmitted to a single glass of water thousands of miles away. Absolutely absurd. Let me know who I can call to get a free phone healing, and you’ve got yourself a deal. Otherwise, I am not giving $90.00 to these con people.

“Meanwhile Chunyi Lin and similar qigong masters like Effie P. Chow, continue their successful healing practices where they can focus their energy on healing people, using love energy. This is why the placebo control is not used because the qigong master can feel the pain of the person they are with so it is not fair to do a pretend healing for another person.

On the other hand if the healing does work but it is considered to be just a placebo then that it just a term for something that is undefinable by Western science. This is also why a “double blind” study can not be done because the definition of qi is more of an open flowing process — similar to the time-frequency uncertainty principle in quantum physics.”

Oh, how convenient; the way qigong works inherently precludes it from being tested scientifically. This is such a huge cop-out. It’s utterly ridiculous. What’s the point in performing the studies at all then? If qigong is not able to be subjected to scientifically rigorous testing, then why do you claim that these tests have been done, and in a rigorous way?

“Colin this is the relevant evidence you should address:

Conclusions:

“Subjects with chronic pain who received external qigong experienced reduction in pain intensity following each qigong treatment. This is especially impressive given the long duration of pain (>5 years) in the most of the participants,” writes lead author Ann Vincent, MD, MBBS, Mayo Clinic, Rochester, Minnesota.”

This would be impressive if it were actually tested in a scientifically rigorous way, where the patients weren’t already partial to the idea of qigong. There is absolutely no way to evaluate this claim, since it’s just an anecdote. Stop amassing anecdotes. They carry no weight. Give real evidence that can be evaluated.

“So the woo woo masters (i.e. the skeptics) can ignore the dramatic personal testimonies of other Mayo Clinic patients healed of hard to treat conditions like breast cancer and the rare lung disease — requiring a lung transplant! These are personal testimonies corroborated by doctors from the Mayo Clinic with x-rays.”

And the study is. . . where?

“Honestly does Colin really think that people with long term chronic pain would have some sort of psychological blockage that needed a qigong placebo treatment to unblock?”

No, just the well-known fact that the mind is very powerful and that people have been known to show significant signs of improvement towards placebos and sham treatments just because they THINK they are receiving medicine or real treatment. Do you deny this?

“If a qigong master “convinces” someone they are doing a healing when in fact (according to sceptics this healing is impossible) and then the healing in fact does work — ergo it is a placebo by the definition of the sceptics.”

Wrong. Placebos and sham treatments are used so that one is able to COMPARE it to groups receiving the real thing. A skeptic would only say that, without a proper control group, the placebo effect can’t be ruled out as an explanation. That is why you perform an experiment with an adequate control-so the placebo effect can be ruled out if the group receiving the real treatment shows a statistically significant difference. This is standard practice.

No more anecdotes, Drew. I will no longer respond to comments of yours consisting of nothing more than stories and personal testemonies. Show me some actual, properly controlled studies, and then you’ll have me undivided attention. Also, keep in mind that my article didn’t debunk qigong, it debunked the SFQ study. I remain open to qigong being real, but I really can’t take it seriously if there is nothing more than anecdotal evidence supporting it, and no mechanism described to account for it. If it’s real, do a real study, and collect your Nobel prize.

Very good response Colin! I appreciate your bravado. Haha. No more ancedotes? Hilarious. To consider the healing of serious illnesses to be mere “ancedotes” is tragic — ancedotes confirmed by their doctors, including the official Mayo Clinic study. Yes these are real people who really believe they’ve been healed of serious illnesses. If you want to call them mere ancedotes that error is called the “fallacy of misplaced concreteness.” It’s mistaking a formal concept for actual reality. haha. The qigong masters are focused on healing people and continue to do so successfully, as the doctors have confirmed.

Colin when you state: “Do you deny this?” about placebos you are demanding a formal conceptual dualistic answer that doesn’t fit the reality of the situation. It’s equivalent to an evangelical Christian demanding that you confess Jesus as your personal savior. Do you deny this? the evangelical demands. In other words let’s say someone is a Christian — but if they refuse to play the formal conceptual game of the evangelical — a personal control fetish — then the evangelical rejects the person as not a real Christian.

Obviously the evangelical vehemently insists he is right and there’s no other way to find the truth and similarly the skeptics refuse the reality of people being healed of serious illnesses not treated successfully by Western medicine. The western doctors are on the record stating that the healing works — even with dramatic physical ailments. The sceptics insist it’s just a placebo — again that’s just a formality. If it works it works! Call it whatever you want — a placebo or an ancedote. haha.

O.K. so my point that I made previously about the placebo is now well-recognized by science — it’s not something I just made up:

http://yjhm.yale.edu/essays/ecohen1.htm

The Placebo Disavowed: Or Unveiling the Bio-Medical Imagination

Ed Cohen
[email protected]

“The May 24, 2001, issue of The New England Journal of Medicine contained a provocative article by two Danish researchers Asbjorn Hrobjartsson and Peter Gotzsche entitled “Is the Placebo Powerless?” Based on a meta-analysis of 130 clinical trials for a wide range of treatments (including pharmacologic, physical, and psychological protocols) that provided comparisons of placebo with non-treatment results, the authors concluded: “We found little evidence in general that placebos had powerful clinical effects. . . . Outside the setting of clinical trials, there is no justification for the use of placebos.”[i] Proclaiming the “newsworthy-ness” of this conclusion, Gina Kolata, science correspondant for The New York Times, published a first section assessment of the responses to the article that began: “In a new report that is being met with a mixture of astonishment and sometimes disbelief, two Danish researchers say the placebo effect is a myth.”[ii]”

If these are just “mere ancedotes” then what’s the big issue with credibility? Most people don’t lie fanatically and most people have a reality testing capability. If serious illnesses are healed by placebos that implies their condition was not an actual real medical condition — which would put the original diagnosis by western medicine in question. If they are mere ancedotes yet they are also honest then that means the qigong healing works and it’s not controversible.

Indeed they are “mere ancedotes” and that’s exactly what makes them so amazing. haha. So now that the placebo argument has moved onto the “mere ancedote” argument we have what Professor Harry M. Collin details as the “experimenter’s regress”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Experimenter%27s_regress

Experimenter’s regress occurs at the “research frontier” where the outcome of research is uncertain, for the scientist is dealing with “novel phenomena”. Collins puts it this way: “usually, successful practice of an experimental skill is evident in a successful outcome to an experiment, but where the detection of a novel phenomenon is in question, it is not clear what should count as a ‘successful outcome’ – detection or non detection of the phenomenon”. In new fields of research where no paradigm has yet evolved and where no consensus exists as what counts as proper research, experimenter’s regress is a problem that often occurs. Also in situations where there is much controversy over a discovery or claim due to opposing interests, dissenters will often question experimental evidence that founds a theory. Because for Collins, all scientific knowledge is socially constructed, there are no purely cognitive reasons or objective criteria that determine whether a claim is valid or not. The regress must be broken by “social negotiation” between scientists in the respective field.

Discuss